[Libertarian]

I switched from IE to Firefox last week. I was tired of all the news on new security holes and Microsloth's failure to respond with anything but "Pay us for XP SP2 and all your woes will be gone." I had tried Opera several years ago and wasn't impressed. I am not all that impressed with Firefox truth be told. It takes forever to open a window and won't let me customize the arrangement of my favourites. But it is supposed to be more secure than IE so I will stick with it for now. I only have 192 mb RAM on my P3-450 laptop and Firefox is supposed to use less memory than IE so that is another reason to stay.

Any other reviews, experiances or complaints?

[Aleph Null]

Interesting how our experiences are different here. I'm someone who never changes software -- I mean, I'm using an email client written in the 1980s -- and yet a month after downloading Firefox (then Firebird) I made it my default client.

The slow window opening thing bothers me too, and it's only in the last couple of versions that it started. Not sure why, I need to try to figure that out.

Two things...

1. Are you using tabs? Tabbed browsing takes time to get used to but it is a BIG improvement over having zillions of windows. Look into that.

2. A lot of cool functions in Firefox are implemented as extensions, not built-in functionality. I have extensions that let me automatically save all my tabs, show me my local weather forecast and more. Go to Tools -> Extensions and then check out all the ones available.

I bet OS can chime in here too....

c

[SageTheRage]

Yes, you're right about Ought6. He wrote a great review and analysis 'elsewhere'. I made notes to my file based on his findings. I encourage him to post his experiences here. It was a well-balanced and informative review IMHO.

[Clawdia]

I'm running Firefox 1.0 on a G4 iBook. It's only got an 800 processor, but I maxed out the RAM at 640 (hacking can get even more RAM than that, but things work well with that much). I'm a big believer in the more RAM the better - for something that used to be so expensive, it sure is cheap now. I have refused for years to use anything Mr. Softy has invented (nobody else brings out such buggy software without even the courtesy to label it "beta"). I used to use Netscape, then went to Safari when Apple came out with it. It became so sluggish I changed to Firefox - no going back now. We have DSL, but Firefox really makes a difference. Don't know how my experience with it would relate to the PC world, though.

[Ought Six]

I have been an Opera user for years. Unfortunately, since I bought my latest used PC, it is not happy with the combination of software I am using. The combo of Win98SE, Opera, DirectX v.9 and the old video drivers for the onboard video card has been a very bad one, causing frequent crashes. For this reason, I was forced to switch browsers to see if that would cure the problem (until I can afford to build a new PC). Sometimes certain combos of software and hardware just do not coexist well together, and that was unfortunately the case with my system.

So, I just reformatted my hard disk and installed Firefox. I can now give you a good comparison of the two browsers.


Opera

I really like Opera. It is the fastest browser I have ever used. It has some cool features, like telling you the speed of the data stream when you are loading a page or downloading a file. You can also open 'panels' for your bookmarks, download manager, email, address book, etc. It even has a panel where you can write notes to yourself. There is also a feature called 'mouse gestures' (holding down the button and moving the mouse right or left), but I never used it. Other people seem to like that feature. When you open a second or third browser window, it opens them within the same instance of Opera that is already running, instead of opening a new instance of the browser for each window (like IE & Firefox do). Opera's method is much faster. Opera does seem to have a problem digesting some Macromedia Flash content, not displaying it properly.


Firefox

I see little difference between Firefox and IE. I think that is done on purpose, I guess to make it easier for IE users to make the transition. Firefox is a lot slower than Opera, which is frustrating for me and will take some getting used to. It is even worse when you open a second browser window. I am used to them popping up instantly, instead of waiting for them to start up. Another negative is that on TB2k, thread that I have opened change color, but for some reason that feature does not work with Firefox, which is irritating and inconveninet. The bookmark manager gets confused and hosed up easily, and must be closed and reopened to get it to work properly. On the plus side, Firefox appears to use less RAM than Opera, so if you have a system that is very short on system resources, that is a plus. It also appears to deal with Macromedia Flash stuff on websites better than Opera.


My conclusion is that once I get a new system, I am going back to Opera.

[chipste®]

Firefox using tabbed browsing here. I really like it other than the fact it is really slow to open. Using Mac OS 10.3 on an ancient Powerbook.

[Pepper]

I have, Firefox, IE, and Opera. I keep going back to Firefox. O6, i'm using the free version of Opera, and I find it very slow and confussing to boot. Is the paid verison better? For me all three are slow with IE being the turtle of the three.
But, I have dialup. :censored:

[Yammy]

I have all three, I tend to use Firefox although I do like Opera as well. It's just the whole bookmarks thing.

I don't find that FireFox is that slow to load? Seems to be about the same as the others on my pc.

[Ought Six]

P:

I have never used the purchased version of Opera. I have DSL, and the speed difference is really noticable. Opera is much faster than Firefox or IE.

[Green]

OK, I'm sold. I'm gonna try Opera. Had to abandon EI at work due to constant infestations. Switched to Mozilla, no more problem. Would like to upgrade to a more high tech versition though. Thanks for the tip, 0-6.

Green

[Ought Six]

Y:

By "the bookmark thing", if you mean converting your bookmarks from one browser to another, try Bookmark Bridge.

http://bookmarkbridge.sourceforge.net/news.html

[Libertarian]

I want Firefox to open in less than 60 seconds after I click on a link in e-mail or click on the Firefox button on the desktop. Once it is open, I can deal with it (unless I need to spawn a new process). Yes, I know about tabbed browsing. I prefer new windows.

[Ought Six]

New browser wins over net surfers (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/4037833.stm)


BBC News
Wednesday, 24 November, 2004

The proportion of surfers using Microsoft's Internet Explorer (IE) has dropped to below 90%, say web analysts. Net traffic monitor, OneStat.com, has reported that the open-source browser Firefox 1.0, released on 9 November, seems to be drawing users away from IE.

While IE's market share has dropped 5% since May to 88.9%, Mozilla browsers - including Firefox - have grown by 5%.

Firefox is made by the Mozilla Foundation which was set up by former browser maker Netscape in 1998.

Although there have been other preview versions of Firefox, version 1.0 was the first complete official program.

"It seems that people are switching from Microsoft's Internet Explorer to Mozilla's new Firefox browser," said Niels Brinkman, co-founder of Amsterdam-based OneStat.com.

Strong grip

Mozilla browsers - including Firefox 1.0 - now have 7.4% of the market share, the figures suggest. Mozilla said that more than five million have downloaded the free software since its official release.

Supporters of the open-source software in the US managed to raise $250,000 (£133,000) to advertise the release of Firefox 1.0 in The New York Times, and support the Mozilla Foundation.

There was a flurry of downloads on its first day of release.


The figures echo similar research from net analyst WebSideStory which suggested that IE had 92.9% of users in October compared to 95.5% in June.

Microsoft IE has dominated the browser market for some time after taking the crown from Netscape, and its share of users has always stayed at around the 95% mark.

Firefox is attractive to many because it is open-source. That means people are free to adapt the software's core code to create other innovative features, like add-ons or extensions to the program.

Fewer security holes have also been discovered so far in Firefox than in IE.

Paul Randle, Microsoft Windows Client product manager, responded to the figures: "We certainly respect that some customers will choose alternative browsers and that choosing a browser is about more than a handful of features.

"Microsoft continues to make significant investments in IE, including Service Pack 2 with advanced security technologies, and continues to encourage a vibrant ecosystem of third party add-ons for Internet Explorer."

Firefox wants to capture 10% of the market by the end of 2005. Other browser software, like Opera and Apple's Safari, are also challenging Microsoft's grip on the browser market. Opera is set to release its version 7.60 by the end of the year.

OneStat.com compiled the statistical measurements from two million net users in 100 countries.

----------

MOST POPULAR BROWSERS


1 - Microsoft IE 6.0: 80.95%
2 - Microsoft IE 5.0: 4.18%
3 - Microsoft IE 5.5: 3.66%
4 - Mozilla Firefox 0.1: 2.79%
5 - Mozilla 1.x: 2.77%
6 - Mozilla Firefox 1.0: 1.79%
7 - Opera 7.x: 1.29%



Source: OneStat.com Nov 2004

[Libertarian]

Next question: How do you remove IE from Windows? I don't think it is possible. I hope I am wrong. Perhaps I could just render it inoperable so nothing can launch it in secret.

[Ought Six]

Here is a method from the SillyDog.com forum: First open IE, and open the options screen by clicking on 'Tools' at the top of the screen and clicking on 'Options'.,

Arrow Click the 'Connections' tab at the top of the new options window that has appeared.

Arrow Click the 'LAN Settings' button that is towards the bottom of the options window.

Arrow Check the box that says 'Use a proxy server for your LAN'.

Arrow In the 'Address' field, enter anything - I put 'fakeproxy'.

Arrow Click the 'Advanced' button, then in the 'exceptions' text box enter '*.microsoft.com' and then click OK.
Now IE will only function on pages at Microsoft.com, and WindowsUpdate.

-------------

This method may not work for truly sophisticated worms that spawn their own hidden IE windows and do not care about proxy settings. Unfortunately, you are right in saying that you cannot completely remove IE on any version of Windows newer than Win98, because Windows now uses and relies upon IE components.

One thing this little blurb did not mention.... When you install some programs that need to connect to the internet, like Spybot's update feature, for example, they will take their proxy settings from IE. You would then need to go in and change the settings manually. So if you do this, beware when you install new programs.

Here is another method from the same forum....

----------

In NT4 and Win2k the file is located in C:\WINNT\SYSTEM32\MSHTML.DLL, in WinXP (Pro only!) in C:\WINDOWS\SYSTEM32\MSHTML.DLL (It doesn't work in 95/98/Me) you just remove all the privledges for all users, and IE can no longer access the internet.

[Ought Six]

On the topic of Firefox, I am rapidly coming to the conclusion that Firefox sucks so mightily in comparison to Opera that I will be switching back. :(

[SmartAZ]

Another browser to try is Slim Browser from http://www.flashpeak.com/ . It's fast. I tried it a few times but still use Mozilla, mainly because it's so familiar.

Libertarian:
Next question: How do you remove IE from Windows? I don't think it is possible.
It's possible in Win98. Click Start/Settings/Control Panel/Add/Remove Programs then click on Internet Explorer. you may need to search for IE*.exe and delete all the fungo copies that various services install. (Corel installed one and my cable service installed another.) Afterwards, go into DOS mode and delete \windows\system\mstask.* so you won't be bothered by any more nags to update your system.

[Watchman63]

I've been using Firefox for a few months, and for the most part I like it. One big problem I have encountered while using Firefox over at TB2K is that when I click on the advanced search link, it locks up all Firefox tabs & windows, to the point that I have to bring up Task Manager and shutdown Firefox. Since we're using vb here, I am guessing that the same problem exists.

The other problem with Firefox is that 10-20% of the video links I click on will not work within Firefox. Occasionally I come across a website that will not work with Firefox, also. The solution for these problems is to open a separate IE window and use it to do whatever Firefox won't do.

I like Firefox, but it is too limited in some respects.

[Ought Six]

I went back to Opera after I discovered the real problem on my system was that Sun Microsystems Java Realtime Environment (JRE) v1.4.2 was not getting along with DirectX v9.0. At the suggestion of Synap over at TB2k, I switched to JRE v1.5.0, and that seemed to cure the crashes. I am very glad to dump Firefox, and hope I never have to use it again.